Building Success & Systems: Growing Tony Geisel Construction from the Ground Up

Audio Transcription

Mark Lamberth
Hello, and welcome to another episode of The Contractor Grow Show. My name is Mark, I’m your host, and today I have the pleasure of talking with Tony Geel at Tony Geel Construction over in Wichita. Tony, thanks for being here with us today.

Tony Giesel
Thanks for inviting me.

Mark Lamberth
Very cool. So Tony, I saw you guys have got a lot of interesting stuff going on. You guys do home remodeling as well as outdoor structures. Maybe you could tell me a little bit about the history of the business and what you guys are up to today.

Tony Giesel
I started my own business in September of 2009, and with the idea that I was going to just have all subtrades and no employees and within a few months I hired my first one. And since then we’ve hired two more. We’re still doing a lot of subtrades, trying to manage them, but still doing some of the finer work ourselves, especially the more detailed work. That’s a little bit where we shine is the detailed part of our business of for sure, the trim work and things like that deck building and some of that just the care that our team takes to put things together.

Mark Lamberth
Okay, fantastic. So you’ve got four people on the team right now, and then how many subs do you tend to deal with?

Tony Giesel
Anywhere from about 20 to 25.

Mark Lamberth
Okay, great. And is it mostly remodels or you guys do some house building as well?

Tony Giesel
We do house building, but dollar wise, of course, the last one I built was a 1.8 million, something like that. Home. We have one, a new slash remodel, it’s an older home that we’re adding onto that’s an $800,000 project and we have a new one we’re working on that’s total. When the job is completed, it’ll be about 1.6, so that’s this year. And we have some window replacement jobs to do that. Each one is probably about $20,000. We got a bathroom remodel that’s 50,000. We have a kitchen remodel that’s over a hundred to start here after the first of the year.

Mark Lamberth
Amazing. And it looks like, I mean, you guys have done great work in the marketplace. I see a lot of great reviews and a lot of great content on your website. I mean, does the business grow mostly by referrals to get these big jobs or do you guys do some outreach as well? And how are you able to get really in Wichita? It sounds like big, big projects.

Tony Giesel
TV advertisement is a lot. That plays a pretty good part. It’s still a lot of referrals in some ways. Maybe our brand has been built and yet, I don’t know if it’s ever fully built, but one of the last jobs we did, I asked him where they heard about us from and they told us that a real estate agent, and I’d never met the lady. She told him, she said, if you want a good home built, you need to call Tony.

Mark Lamberth
That is awesome.

Tony Giesel
Got to make you feel great. Yeah,

Mark Lamberth
Fantastic. And then I noticed that you guys have got a unique product. Looks like you guys do a lot of work with Gutter Dome. Is that a big part of your business? Tell me about that.

Tony Giesel
We haven’t had much rain over the last two or three years, so I started that in about 2013 or 14, 12 or 13, 11 or 12 actually. And I went for about three years just advertising in paper and email blasts and things like that. And I was only selling about $8,500 worth of product a year, and I was spending $10,000 a year advertising. And they told me I either had to start selling more or get out. And so I asked them what I was supposed to do and they told me all their successful clients advertise on tv. So the TV lady came to me and said, what’s your budget? And I said, I don’t have one. And she came up with a number of $3,500 a month and I was going to say no. And I said, well, you know what? I told ’em I would do it. I will for four months, it’s a $14,000 campaign. And that fall, I sold $50,000 worth that fall. And then it grew every year till about probably 2020. I was selling over a hundred thousand dollars worth of product a year. And I’m not sure why I set one of my gut, my gutter subtrades up on it and he orders 2,500 feet at a time.

Tony Giesel
And he advertises that when he puts his gutters on, which is the smart thing to do. And we’re making, I was going to say, we’re making about as much as if we do it ourselves by just letting him do it, our total dollar volume isn’t as much, but we don’t have to go put it on and we don’t have to clean out their gutters and we’re still putting a little on, but I would think if it started to rain again here in Kansas, we would probably sell more.

Mark Lamberth
Right, I’ll bet. I noticed on Google that you guys have got a lot of great reviews from happy customers, although I noticed it once stood out. It looks like about three weeks ago, Vicky left you a fantastic review about your pool pavilion that you built at her home. Maybe you could tell me about that project a little bit.

Tony Giesel
It was a project that she, I think she’d seen us on tv and she emailed me and I emailed back and I didn’t hear anything and she emailed again and I emailed back and I didn’t hear anything and she finally emailed me and said, obviously you don’t want the job because you’re not getting in contact with me. And I said, I immediately picked up the phone and called her and I said, I’ve been responding with an email every time I don’t know where it’s going. I said, when can I come? And she said, can you come today? And I said, yes, I’ll be there. And it was about 30 miles from Wichita. And so I drove out there and did the job and it turned out lovely. Turned out very, very nice. It was a heavy timber frame construction, and we got in and we got the job done and it turned out very nice.

Mark Lamberth
Beautiful. So I mean project like that, I mean 30 miles out, is that still kind within your radius or is that maybe,

Tony Giesel
Yeah.

Mark Lamberth
How far do you guys tend to go out from Wichita to

Tony Giesel
Work? Well, I actually live in Heston Wich. I’m 30 miles from Wichita.

Mark Lamberth
Okay.

Tony Giesel
But we’ll typically drive, most of our jobs would be in that 30 to 40 mile radius, but sometimes we’ll go in the 60 to 70, 80.

Mark Lamberth
Okay. Okay, great. So these days I’ve noticed that there’s more homeowner turning to do it yourself solutions. Folks can go onto YouTube, they can go figure out how to do some of this stuff yourself. How do you communicate the value of hiring an experienced professional like yourself? You’ve been in the business for a long time, you’ve got great people on your team, a ton of experience. Do you ever run into folks thinking, well, maybe I’m just kind kicking the tires a little bit and you need to sort of convey some of that value? I mean, how would you convey the value of working with an experience builder like yourself?

Tony Giesel
I’ll tell ’em they’ll be sorry when they’re sober.

Mark Lamberth
Yeah, awesome. You’ve been drink it. You’re drunk if you think you can do this yourself. Love it.

Tony Giesel
Actually, I mean, I start telling ’em the benefits of hiring a general and to be able to see the project all the way through that mistakes happen when somebody don’t have the vision, a switch box gets put in the wrong place. The subtrades aren’t going to be as willing to come there because they know it’s only a one-time deal, that kind of thing.

Mark Lamberth
Interesting. Okay. And then I was just curious, Tony, I mean, you’ve been in business for a long time and I mean you’ve been around the block a lot running a successful remodel, a kitchen remodel business. It’s often got a lot of challenges. I mean, the challenge is retaining team, putting together subs, put any other quotes. Have you dealt with any kind of obstacles over time at all that you’ve kind of overcome? And how have you dealt with any kind of challenges that may have come up with the business?

GutterDome offers durable gutter guards that prevent clogging, water damage, and reduce the risk of ladder-related injuries. Their products eliminate the need for frequent gutter cleaning, providing long-lasting protection for your home.

Learn more at GutterDome.

Tony Giesel
Well, there’s always the, every project you walk into, there’s the unknown. You tear something apart and you don’t know what’s behind it. And you kind learn what to look for and you learn what may have been there or what may open up when you open up a wall.

Mark Lamberth
Okay. I mean, do you do all of your jobs, are they all quoted or are some of them time and materials to deal with such a problem? We don’t know where we’re going to get into over here. We need to do this on time and materials.

Tony Giesel
I quote, every job has a budget number to it and then I give them a monthly billing that tells ’em what our budget number was and how much we spent. And that number is based off of strictly a percentage of time and material. So in a way, every job is time and material, but I’ve given them a budget number and I’m usually high on that budget number.

Mark Lamberth
Okay. Okay, great. And then I noticed over on I think LinkedIn that you had posted Grant Cardone’s revenue formula. I’m a big fan of Grant Cardone myself, and what that tells me is that you’re really kind of a student of the game of business that looking at outside resources and how to grow your own skills, how has being, I dunno, so to speak, a student of the game or sort of learning and reaching out and reaching outside yourself and learning some things from Grant Cardone. How has that been helpful for you? Why did you post Grant Cardone and what are your thoughts about that?

Tony Giesel
I don’t know. I’ve seen it was an opportunity to post it. I wonder what would happen. Frankly, his program scares the crap out of me.

Mark Lamberth
Oh, is that right?

Tony Giesel
Yeah, I’m kind of new into it. I haven’t been into it very long. And I know he pushes you to the limit. And I bought into the program because in about five years I want to quit. I want to be done. I’m 60 years old and I have other things that I would like to go do and I really don’t want to work this hard all my life. I’ve given it get up at five in the morning and I usually go in the house at eight 30 in the evening. Really, I haven’t been smart enough to put the proper people into place to help me to grow and to scale. I haven’t had that knowledge. I haven’t had the experience. I haven’t done what I should have done all these years. Instead I’ve came out here and I’ve just bulged my way through the whole thing.

Mark Lamberth
Interest, interesting idea there. I’m just curious, and are listeners probably mean by your perspective, what would be some of those right things to, you talk about putting the team people in place, that hasn’t really happened, but what advice would you have for a younger man or woman getting into the trade these days such that they do do it right?

Want to grow your remodeling or contractor business through effective leadership? Mark explains how leadership is a skill that can be learned, using insights from John Maxwell’s 21 Irrefutable Laws of Leadership. He emphasizes the importance of guiding teams with shared values and clear goals for business success.

Tony Giesel
Well, number one, you have to do what you say you’ll do. And you have to be there when you need to be there. And if you say, I’m going to be there at 10 o’clock in the morning, you’ll be there at 10 o’clock in the morning or else you’ll make a phone call and say, I’m going to be five minutes late. Or the worst case scenario is you forgot the appointment. But once you, Cardone says that you can get to your by yourself, you can go to 1 million and maybe to two. And then too many people miss the three and four and they get to 5 million and they realize that they miss what should have grown in the two to three or the three to four. And I did all my own bookwork. I’ve entered all my bills, I’ve paid all my bills, I’ve did all my quoting, I did all my sales calling. I’ve did everything that there was to do out of the office. And I came to a place where I can’t get any bigger because I’m completely loaded. Full.

Mark Lamberth
Gotcha. Are you guys kind of at that three 4 million revenue mark now? Is it kind of the zone? Gotcha. And do you have thoughts about what, you’re talking about retiring here in five years. Do you have thoughts about what kind of revenue you’d love to get to in the next few years? Mean do you have some goals there?

Tony Giesel
Well, I mean I’d like to see it grow to, I have two sons that are in it with me and I’d like to see it be quite profitable and I don’t want them to have to work the kind of hours I worked. It’s not that I’m trying to pave an easy road for them. I don’t want, why should they start over where I started and why should they go through what I’ve been through? Why can’t it be if these things are put in place and the processes and systems that I’ve never had, if all of that can be put into place for them, why not?

Mark Lamberth
That’s great.

Tony Giesel
And so the two sons are in the business with me. One is out in the field, one is in the office. They both want to take it over at sometime. And if we can grow to six or eight or 10 would be nice. But I’ve also did all my own project management and followed up and I’ve lost customers because of how busy I’ve been and I haven’t been able to get to it quick enough.

Mark Lamberth
Those are useful lessons, Tony, I really appreciate you sharing that stuff. Right and mean, we have builders of all ages and a lot of folks, contractor growth show folks trying to grow their company. And I think it’s really great to hear some reflections on maybe some things, some advice from a seasoned builder of, if you’re starting this up, make sure you take care of these things. And lemme ask you this, you said a minute ago when you’re talking about Grant Cardone, you can get to one or 2 million and then you can skip to 5 million or you may skip to 5 million, but you may skip to three and 4 million. I think there’s probably some insight in there. What do you mean by that?

Tony Giesel
Well, you miss putting all the systems and processes into place.

Mark Lamberth
Okay, interesting.

Tony Giesel
You can hire some people, you can do some of this stuff, but you miss putting those proper things into place that help that flow smoothly throughout.

Mark Lamberth
I see. And is that something that you guys are kind of considering now or focusing on a little bit? It’s like

Tony Giesel
We’re doing that.

Mark Lamberth
Okay. Okay,

Tony Giesel
Great. We finished a window project in a town 80 miles away. The guys were freshly done with it. My oldest son worked there and I told him on Saturday, I said, I want you to write down everything that you did on that project, how you did it, what the processes were, what the steps were. And he says, well, it can be five different ways. And I said, I fully understand that. But I said, when you’re in the position to tell somebody how to do it, how are you going to tell ’em how to do it? Or are you going to let ’em go there and wing it? I said, why can’t we have this written down so the next person knows exactly how to do it?

Mark Lamberth
That’s great. And we actually haven’t had guests talk too much about that here on the show, and I really appreciate you talking about that. So systems, I mean, basically when you go out to a job, maybe including even just how the tools are dealt with, I mean all kinds of things, but there’s just all kinds of repetitive parts of the remodeling business that there’s no reason to go out and figure it out. Again, things can happen efficiently if there’s a system in place. And so if you guys are scaling your team, then that written systems or systems in different ways, maybe video. There’s all kinds of ways to create systems. But basically if those are in place, you can train your new team with that and you can say, this is how we want this done. And you’ve got kind of a minimum level of a standard and expectation and they can kind of replicate that the way that you guys have done it in the past.

Tony Giesel
Right.

Mark Lamberth
Okay, great. Do you use any software, Tony, that’s helpful for running the business?

Tony Giesel
We’re getting into a system that’s called Teams. You’re probably familiar with that. We’re kind of new into that and I know a little bit about it. I don’t know enough about it to talk very much about it. My youngest son is into it a whole lot more than I am. And there’s a gal out of Wichita that’s been helping us put that all together and doing the WIP reports, the work in progress reports and all of that. He’s got into that and that’s been very helpful.

Mark Lamberth
And then Tony, I was just curious, last few questions here. I mean, you talked about retiring here in five years. I mean, you’ve had a long career and just curious. We talked with a lot of builders that are just jamming. I mean, they’re out in the marketplace every day. They’re out in their community. They’re doing amazing work, but it’s not always easy to keep a great work-life balance. Right. Folks just slamming away at it, we’re all guilty of working too hard sometimes. Do you have any ways that you recharge and other things that you do other than work that are helpful for you or when you’re looking to retire? I mean, what are anything you’re willing to share about other things you’re thinking about, what you be doing with your time after you retired?

Tony Giesel
I would like to go do some voluntary service somewhere. I’d like to travel a little bit more than what we did. I’m sure that after five years, it’s very possible that I’m still a little bit involved here for a bit. They don’t know that.

Mark Lamberth
They don’t know. You may still be around even though they think the rooster has flown the coop, he may still be kind of circling around here and there.

Tony Giesel
It’s very possible. Don’t, I’m not one to sit around. I’m sure that I’m going to keep busy with something. I know that I think that some of my suppliers would probably hire me to come work a few days a week if that’s what I want to do.

Mark Lamberth
Okay.

Tony Giesel
I don’t know. I have a hobby. I like to grow meat and smoke meat and is that right? Other than that, I can’t wait to get up in the morning. And on Fridays when I call people, they tell me they’re so glad it’s Friday. And I tell ’em it’s one day closer to Monday.

Mark Lamberth
Right.

Tony Giesel
And I usually get that kind of response.

Mark Lamberth
That’s great. So you grow meat. Do you have some livestock there?

Tony Giesel
No, I buy my meat and I took an old outdoor grain bin and I built an outdoor kitchen in it.

Mark Lamberth
That is awesome. How cool. What a great hobby. That sounds so fun. Well, fantastic. Well, Tony, a lot of great information, a lot of great lessons, and I appreciate you just kind of opening up and sharing some of the numbers and sharing maybe ways to do things a little bit different, maybe get systems in place a little bit earlier. I mean, it’s a great business and the work that you guys do is beautiful. And anybody that is in Wichita or within a hundred miles of Wichita, absolutely. Take a look at Tony’s site. It’s tony geel construction.com, it’s Tony, and then G-I-E-S-E-L construction.com. Are there other ways that are good to get in touch with you, Tony? Or is the website the best way?

Tony Giesel
Email or call.

Mark Lamberth
Okay. Alright. Sounds like you’re happy to pick up the phone and

Tony Giesel
Get

Mark Lamberth
On a call with somebody pretty quick.

Tony Giesel
Yeah.

Mark Lamberth
Okay, perfect. Well, Tony, thank you for being on the show today. I really appreciate you taking the time. I know you’re really busy, especially here at the Christmas season, end of 2024. So thank you for taking the time and hopefully folks, if you’re in Wichita, get in touch with Tony. He’d love to work with you.

Tony Giesel
Thanks so much.

Mark Lamberth
Okay. Talk to you soon.

Tony Giesel
Thank you.

Watch Andy Cruse share how he built Andrew K. Cruse Painting by offering services like interior cabinet painting and power washing. He emphasizes the importance of industry connections and associations to grow his team of 12 skilled workers.